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The 39 Questions Both Sides On The Prop 8 Trial Must Answer Today

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Proposition 8, California’s November, 2008 offense against America that bans same-sex couples from marrying, has been on trial — federal trial, that is — since January. The federal case, technically Perry v. Schwarzenegger, concludes this week, with closing arguments starting tomorrow, after months of hiatus. Judge Vaughn Walker has presented both sides with a total of thirty-nine questions they were compelled to answer in writing by noon today or be prepared to answer during closing arguments tomorrow.

There are several references to “Blankenhorn,” as in David Blankenhorn. Here’s a link, and another, but perhaps most importantly, the admission of his lie, to give you some background.

I’ve taken the liberty of copying them in part, stripping the legal references, adding hyperlinks when helpful, and then adding my thoughts (italicized) to a few of them. You’ll find the full, actual document at the end.

I have to say many of these questions would be great debate questions for any group to discuss!

Here’s the list:

To the (pro-gay marriage) plaintiffs:

1. Assume the evidence shows Proposition 8 is not in fact rationally related to a legitimate state interest. Assume further the evidence shows voters genuinely but without evidence believed Proposition 8 was rationally related to a legitimate interest. Do the voters’ honest beliefs in the absence of supporting evidence have any bearing on the constitutionality of Proposition 8? (This gets to the very heart of majority rule, the need for a representative democracy, “the will of the people,” and why civil rights should never be voted upon.)

2. What evidence supports a finding that maintaining marriage as an opposite-sex relationship does not afford a rational basis for Proposition 8?

3. Until very recently, same-sex relationships did not enjoy legal protection anywhere in the United States. How does this fact square with plaintiffs’ claim that marriage between persons of the same sex enjoys the status of a fundamental right entitled to constitutional protection?

4. What is the import of evidence showing that marriage has historically been limited to a man and a woman? What evidence shows that that limitation no longer enjoys constitutional recognition?

5. What does the evidence show regarding the intent of the voters? If the evidence shows that Proposition 8 on its face and through its consequences distinguishes on the basis of sexual orientation and sex, of what import is voter intent?

6. What empirical data, if any, supports a finding that legal recognition of same-sex marriage reduces discrimination against gays and lesbians? (There is data. And studies of school-aged children to support this.)

7. What evidence supports a finding that recognition of same-sex marriage would afford a permanent – as opposed to a transitory – benefit to the City and County of San Francisco? To California cities and counties generally? (The framing here is a concern to me because it is a federal trial.)

8. What is the relevance, if any, of data showing that state and local governments would benefit economically if same-sex couples were permitted to marry? Does that relevance depend on the magnitude of the economic benefit? (Tons of evidence here.)

9. What are the consequences of a permanent injunction against enforcement of Proposition 8? What remedies do plaintiffs propose?

10. Even if enforcement of Proposition 8 were enjoined, plaintiffs’ marriages would not be recognized under federal law. Can the court find Proposition 8 to be unconstitutional without also considering the constitutionality of the federal Defense of Marriage Act? (In my non-legal opinion, yes it can.)

11. What evidence supports a finding that the choice of a person of the same sex as a marriage partner partakes of traditionally revered liberties of intimate association and individual autonomy? (To any gay person, I would think this one is a rather easy one to answer…)

12. If the evidence of the involvement of the LDS and Roman Catholic churches and evangelical ministers supports a finding that Proposition 8 was an attempt to enforce private morality, what is the import of that finding? (Is Walker covering his bases? Or looking for an eventual Supreme Court ruling to include an examination of First Amendment rights? Also, see: “Prop 8 proponents lose pre-closing skirmish“)

To the (anti-gay marriage) proponents:

1. Assuming a higher level of scrutiny applies to either plaintiffs’ due process or equal protection claim, what evidence in the record shows that Proposition 8 is substantially related to an important government interest? Narrowly tailored to a compelling government interest? (In other words, especially for you Libertarians out there, what business does the government have in maintaining only “traditional” marriage?)

2. Aside from the testimony of Mr Blankenhorn, what evidence in the record supports a finding that same-sex marriage has or could have negative social consequences? What does the evidence show the magnitude of these consequences to be? (See above re: Blankenhorn. And, there are no negative social consequences. Well, unless you’re a hateful bigot.)

3. The court has reserved ruling on plaintiffs’ motion to exclude Mr Blankenhorn’s testimony. If the motion is granted, is there any other evidence to support a finding that Proposition 8 advances a legitimate governmental interest? (Prop 8 does not advance any governmental interest. The role of government in marriage is that government has acknowledged that marriage is of benefit to society. The government can no more make a judgment that only opposite sex marriage is a benefit to society than it can that marriage within one’s race is beneficial to society. And it has already struck that down.)

4. Why should the court assume that the deinstitutionalization of marriage is a negative consequence?

5. What evidence in the record shows that same-sex marriage is a drastic or far-reaching change to the institution of marriage?

6. What evidence in the record shows that same-sex couples are differently situated from opposite-sex couples where at least one partner is infertile?

7. Assume the evidence shows that children do best when raised by their married, biological mother and father. Assume further the court concludes it is in the state’s interest to encourage children to be raised by their married biological mother and father where possible. What evidence if any shows that Proposition 8 furthers this state interest? (This assumption is false. Two long-term studies released last week prove it is false.)

8. Do California’s laws permitting same-sex couples to raise and adopt children undermine any conclusion that encouraging children to be raised by a married mother and father is a legitimate state interest?

9. How does the Supreme Court’s holding in Michael H v Gerald D, 491 US 110 (1989) square with an emphasis on the importance of a biological connection between parents and their children?

10. Assume the evidence shows that sexual orientation is socially constructed. Assume further the evidence shows Proposition 8 assumes the existence of sexual orientation as a stable category. What bearing if any do these facts have on the constitutionality of Proposition 8?

11. Why is legislating based on moral disapproval of homosexuality not tantamount to discrimination? See Doc #605 at 11 (“But sincerely held moral or religious views that require acceptance and love of gay people, while disapproving certain aspects of their conduct, are not tantamount to discrimination.”). What evidence in the record shows that a belief based in morality cannot also be discriminatory? If that moral point of view is not held and is disputed by a small but significant minority of the community, should not an effort to enact that moral point of view into a state constitution be deemed a violation of equal protection? (Remember this one!)

12. What harm do proponents face if an injunction against the enforcement of Proposition 8 is issued? (None. Groups like NOM will make a fortune taking this to the Supreme Court.)

To (pro and anti-gay marriage) Plaintiffs and Proponents:

1. What party bears the burden of proof on plaintiffs’ claims? Under what standard of review is the evidence considered?

2. Does the existence of a debate inform whether the existence of a rational basis supporting Proposition 8 is “debatable” or “arguable” under the Equal Protection Clause?

3. What does the evidence show the difference to be between gays and lesbians, on the one hand, and heterosexuals on the other? Is that difference one which the government “may legitimately take into account” when making legislative classifications?

4. What does the evidence show the definition (or definitions) of marriage to be? How does Professor Cott’s proposed definition of marriage fit within Mr Blankenhorn’s testimony that competing definitions of marriage are either focused on children or focused on spousal affection?

5. What does it mean to have a “choice” in one’s sexual orientation? (Critical question.)

6. In order to be rooted in “our Nation’s history, legal traditions, and practices,” is it sufficient that a practice has existed historically, or need there be an articulable purpose underlying the practice? (I would suggest looking at slavery, women’s suffrage, etc.)

7. If spouses are obligated to one another for mutual support and support of dependents, and if legal spousal obligations have no basis in the gender of the spouse, what purpose does a law requiring that a marital partnership consist of one man and one woman serve? (EXACTLY!)

8. The California Family Code requires that registered domestic partners be treated as spouses. Businesses that extend benefits to married spouses in California must extend equal benefits to registered domestic partners. If, under California law, registered domestic partners are to be treated just like married spouses, what purpose is served by differentiating – in name only – between same-sex and opposite-sex unions? (Perception and bigotry need little to be maintained…)

9. What evidence, if any, shows whether infertility has ever been a legal basis for annulment or divorce?

10. How should the failure of the Briggs Initiative (Proposition 6 in 1978) or the LaRouche Initiative (Proposition 64 in 1986) be viewed in determining whether gays and lesbians are politically powerless?

11. What are the constitutional consequences if the evidence shows that sexual orientation is immutable for men but not for women? Must gay men and lesbians be treated identically under the Equal Protection Clause?

12. How many opposite-sex couples have registered as domestic partners under California law? Are domestic partnerships between opposite-sex partners or same-sex partners recognized in other jurisdictions? If appropriate, the parties may rely on documents subject to judicial notice to answer this question.

13. Do domestic partnerships create legal extended family relationships or in-laws?

14. What does the evidence show regarding the difficulty or ease with which the State of California regulates the current system of opposite-sex and same-sex marriage and opposite-sex and same-sex domestic partnerships?

15. If the court finds Proposition 8 to be unconstitutional, what remedy would “yield to the constitutional expression of the people of California’s will”?

Doc 677

http://d1.scribdassets.com/ScribdViewer.swf?document_id=32724803&access_key=key-jssxoh15lutku7zmgyn&page=1&viewMode=list

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Congressman Pummeled for Praising Students Mocking Black Protester With Monkey Sounds

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U.S. Rep. Mike Collins, Republican of Georgia, is under fire after praising University of Mississippi students, some wearing American flag outfits, mocking a Black woman protester by making monkey sounds and shouting, “lock her up.”

“Counter-protestors at the University of Mississippi made racist remarks — including monkey noises and comparisons to Lizzo — towards a Black woman who was part of a planned protest against the war in Gaza,” Los Angeles Magazine reported Friday.

Collins, who tried to defund Vice President Kamala Harris’ Office in November, declared his support for the counter-protesters at “Ole Miss,” as the University is called.

“Ole Miss taking care of business,” he wrote on social media, atop the video (below).

The counter-protesters, as evidenced in the video, appear to be mostly white.

A large number of users on the social media platform X responded, accusing the Congressman and the counter-protesters of racism.

“When is the inevitable ‘I don’t have a racist bone in my body’ tweet coming,” wondered Rewire News Group editor-at-large Imani Gandy.

“Which part is your favorite, Mike?” asked Fred Wellman, the former executive director of The Lincoln Project. “Is it the white kid acting like a monkey at the black woman or the white security guy acting like she’s a threat? I’m trying to figure out which flavor of racism has you all excited the most?”

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Harvard Law Cyberlaw Clinic clinical instructor Alejandra Caraballo responded to the Georgia GOP congressman, “Thanks for confirming you’re a massive racist piece of sh*t.”

Mississippi Free Press news editor Ashton Pittman wrote: “Rep. Mike Collins, R-Georgia, praises a video showing a University of Mississippi frat boy dancing like a monkey and making monkey noises near a Black woman student who was protesting for Palestine while other frat boys chant ‘lock her up.'”

In a separate post describing a separate video taken of the same group Pittman wrote: “Frat bros at @OleMiss chant, ‘Lizzo! Lizzo!’ and shout, ‘F**k you fatass, f**k you b*tch’ at a Black woman who was protesting for Palestine. Do people really think these counterprotestors are doing it to support Jews?”

Journalist John Harwood did not mince words, writing, “Congressman proud of the racism.”

“Okay, Mike. We get it,” wrote podcast host, documentary director, and author W. Kamau Bell. “You want to be famous for being a racist. Fine. I’ll help you become a famous racist. You’re welcome.”

The original video is here.

See Rep. Collins’ post and the video below or at this link.

Caution: the video is disturbing.

READ MORE: Noem Heads to Mar-a-Lago After Branding Kids She Ministered in Church ‘Little Tyrants’

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Noem Heads to Mar-a-Lago After Branding Kids She Ministered in Church ‘Little Tyrants’

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Amid more damning revelations from her soon-to-be released book, embattled South Dakota Republican Governor Kristi Noem will head to Mar-a-Lago this weekend as ex-president Donald Trump auditions potential vice presidential picks in front of high-dollar donors. Noem was also slated to attend a Republican fundraiser in Colorado this weekend but it was canceled over alleged safety concerns after news broke she had bragged about shooting her 14-month old dog.

While Noem’s shooting to death of her wirehaired pointer, Cricket, which she detailed in the book, is still making headlines overnight a new revelation made news: Noem falsely claims in her book she met with North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un.

A spokesperson for Noem “seemed to concede that the Kim story was false Thursday night,” and notified her publisher, Politico’s Ryan Lizza reported in his exclusive.

But less noticed appears to be the actual text of Noem’s false story, in which she brands children she ministered in church “little tyrants,” and compared them to the murderous North Korean dictator.

READ MORE: RFK Jr., Embracing Far-Right, Spoke at Fundraiser for Anti-Government Group With J6 Ties

“Through my tenure on the House Armed Services Committee,” Noem wrote, according to Politico, “I had the chance to travel to many countries to meet with world leaders. I remember when I met with North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un. I’m sure he underestimated me, having no clue about my experience staring down little tyrants (I’d been a children’s pastor, after all).”

CNBC reported this week Trump “will mingle with potential vice presidential running mates and wealthy Republican donors at the Republican National Committee’s spring donor retreat. The meetings are likely to act as informal tryouts for a short list of politicos in the running to join the Trump ticket.”

The list of Republican “special guests” includes U.S. Senators Marco Rubio, Tim Scott, and J.D. Vance, Rep. Elise Stefanik, North Dakota Governor Doug Burgum, and South Dakota Governor Kristi Noem.

Also expected to attend are House Speaker Mike Johnson, U.S. Reps. Byron Donalds of Florida and Wesley Hunt of Texas, former GOP presidential candidate Vivek Ramaswamy, and other elected Republicans along with RNC co-chair Lara Trump.

READ MORE: Election Denialism Embraced by ‘Large Proportion’ of Trump’s Followers: Report

NBC News, which says Rep. Donalds is also under consideration, on Friday added there will be “a fundraising retreat that could serve as a screening session” for potential vice presidential running mates.

Meanwhile, the Jefferson County, Colorado Republican Party chair announced a fundraising dinner Noem was slated to attend was canceled after threats were made, The Denver Post reports.

“We understood there was a planned organized protest outside of the hotel, led by Progress Now,” Nancy Pallozzi said. “I felt that our event would be negatively impacted, and we could not take the risk that those who made threats would cause physical harm.”

 

 

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RFK Jr., Embracing Far-Right, Spoke at Fundraiser for Anti-Government Group With J6 Ties

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Over the weekend independent 2024 presidential candidate Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. spoke at a fundraiser for a far-right anti-government group in Erie County, New York – a slice of the country that had a large proportion of residents arrested and charged for crimes related to the January 6 insurrection. Kennedy, a conspiracy theorist and vaccine denialist, increasingly is embracing the far-right.

“That group, Constitutional Coalition of New York State, has founders who not only have ties to Donald Trump but are also connected to the stop-the-steal movement through their activist network, which includes groups that had a presence at the Capitol on Jan. 6,” The Daily Beast reported Friday. “It’s yet another instance of Kennedy—who is mounting one of the most well-funded third-party presidential threats in decades—serving as a peculiar bridge between his own anti-establishment movement and Trump’s.”

The Southern Poverty Law Center includes the Constitutional Coalition of New York State (CCNYS) on its page of anti-government groups. Political Research Associates, which detailed the high proportion of January 6 residents arrested and charged, included the Constitutional Coalition of New York State in its February report on “The Rise of the Far Right in Western New York.”

READ MORE: Election Denialism Embraced by ‘Large Proportion’ of Trump’s Followers: Report

“If you don’t think the government is lying to you, you’re not paying attention,” Kennedy told attendees at the CCNYS fundraiser, The Buffalo News reports.

“CCNYS founders Nick and Nancie Orticelli are also affiliated with the Watchmen, a nearby militia who Nick has encouraged his social media followers to join. The Watchmen had several members at the Capitol on Jan. 6, and one member, Pete Harding, is still facing charges for violent entry and disorderly conduct on Capitol grounds,” The Daily Beast noted. “Nancie Orticelli has also hosted the Watchmen’s founder, Charles Pellien, on her weekly radio show on several occasions.”

One of Kennedy’s goals in traveling to New York was to get on the ballot for the November presidential election. Various polls show him taking votes from both President Joe Biden and ex-president Donald Trump, but Kennedy currently has only qualified to be on the ballot in three states, Utah, Michigan and Hawaii, the newspaper reported.

But The Washington Post on Thursday reported The American Independent Party of California, which has a history of “far-right ties,” and “backed segregationist and former Alabama governor George Wallace in 1968, nominated Kennedy for president.”

Kennedy “said this week that he has qualified to be on the ballot in California and will accept the nomination of the American Independent Party, which has a history of associating itself with far-right figures and individuals who have expressed racist views.”

Some news reports and RFK Jr. himself say the Trump campaign was actively courting Kennedy, attempting to convince him to consider being the ex-president’s 2024 vice presidential running mate.

“That MAGA dalliance with Kennedy could be coming back to bite the Trump campaign, some Republicans close to the former president worry,” The Daily Beast also reported.

“’They can only blame themselves,’ a Trump-aligned strategist told The Daily Beast, requesting anonymity to speak candidly about private conversations about the risk Kennedy poses, ‘because they cozied up to him and thought it was funny.’”

Watch WIVBTV’s report on Kennedy’s trip to New York below or at this link.

READ MORE: Trump Won’t Commit to Accepting Election Results if He Doesn’t Win State He Falsely Claims He Won

 

 

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